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After a bit of cleaning, and a bit more sopping of some final water that must have finished leaking through the night, I took a look at the pipe. The valve is soldered in, and is much closer to the wall than what I had thought. I have tried a couple of things that might lead to even more water coming out, but slowly and through the drain house (but not at pressure so it's not spraying everywhere). I am not sure if I should cut a pocket hole in the dry wall before I begin soldering or not. It may or may not be required later, but it will add more to my eventual shopping list and to-do list. Though having drywall repair materials on hand isn't a bad plan anyway. I may just go for it, keeping one of the fire extinguishers handy. Now to get dressed and go shopping.
I suppose, as a home owner, you have to learn this stuff sooner or later. Well, on to town. Hmm, I best check my propane torch before I go. I've only used it a few times, and loaned it to my landlord for a five minute job once, so it should be good. But... if you don't check it will be empty/dysfunctional. I learned this from saving games while playing games. *grins* Later.
If you can find a soldering shield at the plumbing store you shop at, those can be tremendously helpful.
ReplyDeleteThe one I have consists of a foil backing holding some sort of fibrous material--not asbestos, but equally flame resistant.
You position said shield between the torch and the flammable materials and solder away.
A union joint and solder shield, eh? Yeah, that sounds good. While Logan is okay, I am not sure they carry this type of thing. I looked over the soldering section pretty thoroughly, and had some of these notions in mind. Nothing there. Ogden might have a bigger selection and there is a bigger H.D. near one of the reloading supply stores we will be visiting.
ReplyDeleteAnd, definitely I will keep you in mind if it doesn't work. You are sort of the tech acorn for this diy'er as is. I've watched you solder (cut, electrify, build, fix, rectify, sort, and figure) for a while now. :)
As for trial by fire? That, honestly, is how most of my life has worked. I rarely have been given training. I am a shock troop, I just... sometimes forget. I'm used to it but it can get a bit old at times. Until I feel the wind in my face as I'm parachuting into something new for the first time and... begin to enjoy it. (Often right before I realize I have no parachute so begin flapping like an idiot:)
This is what a 3/4" copper union looks like:
ReplyDeletehttp://plumbing.hardwarestore.com/52-332-copper-unions-and-couplings/copper-union-253344.aspx
These should be available everywhere.
The solder shield could be hard to find. A plumbing supply house is more likely to carry them than Home Depot.
Here is one:
http://www.cornerhardware.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=33402
Another one (different kind):
ReplyDeletehttp://www.accentshopping.com/product.asp?P_ID=149168
OTOH, it appears that some Home Depots do carry them:
http://www.homedepot.com/buy/plumbing-torches-soldering-irons-solder/oatey-9-in-x-12-in-hands-free-heat-shield-134446.html
Okay, I will look. Like I said, Logan may or may not carry any of that, but if H.D. has it, they should have it in Ogden. They definitely didn't have the shield.
ReplyDeleteIt looks like the one who put in the water heater did add an union. The problem? It was installed after the faulty valve/faucet. The pipe only runs 1" out of the wall, then hits the valve (which runs 3"), then another 1" of pipe, then the union. This will be tight.
Oh, the water out (of the heater) copper line is downsized from (I think it is 3/4") piping down to the next size down (1/2"). Since measurements don't seem to be accurate, I am sort of guessing (being that 1" fittings are too big, and hoping it is 3/4"). Is that an attempt to increase (or cut) water pressure?
I take it you can't reuse old fittings (unless, I suppose, you cut out pipe with it and create a union on both sides)? Assuming the fitting were still useful. Not a relavent question in this case at any rate, just... out there.
One question, what the heck is the purpose of the union? I have tried to do some quick research but am coming up empty so far.
I did figure out, finally, what a union is for. Just woke up, mind you. It is too bad whoever put the water heater in put the union on the wrong side of the valve though! That is going to make this job... tricky... with so little pipe to work with out of the wall.
ReplyDeleteIt actually might be a lot easier to dig back into the wall, add some length of pipe through the wall, and work with that problem first. I thought about putting the union back behind the wall but... why? That won't really add to ease of changing fittings. And unless I were doing it (assuming I remember) it probably wouldn't be used by the 'next guy'.
The problem is that if I cut
the pipe out of the wall, as is, off exactly at the valve I will only have 1" to work with, and maybe less. Some of that has solder on it, not sure that solder cleans off. I'm... thinking as I go.
Think about the fact that you have to insert the pipe about 1/2" to 3/4" into the fitting before soldering it in place. Then think about how you might insert both ends of a rigid piece of pipe into fittings at the same time.
ReplyDeleteCan't be done. That's where the union comes in. Each half of the union can be soldered in place separately, then the two halves can be lined up and the nut portion clamps the two together watertight. You usually want unions on both the hot and cold sides of a water heater, to facilitate replacing it in the future.
Solder fittings can be reused, provided you desoldered them without damage. Usually you will need to flick the excess, leftover hot solder out of them with a wet rag in order to make room enough to slip the new pipe back in place. Tricky operation that sometimes results in burned fingers. You get the fitting hot enough for the solder to be liquid, then quickly stick the rag in and flick it back out. Solder comes with it. Lather, rinse, repeat until you've got most of it out.
Re downsized pipe, sometimes it's because someone is a cheapskate and didn't want to use the larger, more expensive size pipe. But on the hot side there is a good reason for the smaller diameter pipe to the faucets. It takes a shorter length of time to get hot water from the heater to the faucet with a 1/2" pipe versus a 3/4" pipe. Think about the fact that there is more water in a given length of larger pipe. That has to come out at the faucet before the hot water that started back at the heater arrives.
Also sandpaper and coarse steel wool can remove excess solder cold, if you need to connect to an existing pipe stub.
ReplyDelete